Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

My2Cents · Post by **My2Cents** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 8:50 am

Know what ?? I just about have had all the icing on my cake as far as all this is concerned. Here we are at this stage of the game.... all along, people have given their heart and soul to this subject. Facts have been stated and proven by professionals, experts, people who have to live nearby these things, and those who care deeply about our little town's future and the future of Mother Nature herself. People have given of their time to try to convey to others how devistating the effects of these wind mills have been in the other communities, and how devistating it will be if they are allowed on Ice Mountain.
There are 1400 plus names on a petition right now... for sure, these people are in the know. There are still folks out here who still have no clue, nor do they care. There are some who are starting to pay attention now and understanding.
Anyway, what I'm getting to... we took a low blow this morning from someone I have always respected, someone who is doing an outstanding job and is dedicated and cares for our town and it's future... I am very, very, disappointed in the comment that was made.
It's bad enough to believe in something with all your heart and have to accept the fact that you are being labeled an "opponent." I don't like it, but, I've accepted that label overtime. It's bad enough to sit back and listen to some of the misleading information being put out by this windmill company to the public and say nothing. It's bad enough to see them starting to be disrespectful and zero in on certain individuals, who are professionals in the know, and are only presenting the facts. All of that is a tough pill to swallow. However, an article in this morning's paper really floored me !!! Still, I cannot believe it !! I will not mention any name on here as to who wrote it... this individual was going on about all the good things happening in our town and the different things that folks can participate in... and then all of a sudden, boom, the statement.. "And for some of you who just like to argue or controversy then there are things like the Windmill debate, Flood Control, etc....."
Maybe I'm just being too sensitive but having an additional label like this attached because of something I all feel strongly about is a bit much.... it's actually embarrassing. It certainly makes me want to stop mentioning windmills to anybody. We're not argueing.... since we are against these windmills does that make us all arguemental ?? I can't believe this person, who I think the world of, said that to the public.

Ice Man · Post by **Ice Man** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 9:58 am

My2Cents wrote: It certainly makes me want to stop mentioning windmills to anybody.

That's exactly that person's intent.

My2Cents wrote: I can't believe this person, who I think the world of, said that to the public.

You need to revise your opinion of that person.

My2Cents · Post by **My2Cents** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 12:40 pm

I can't do either Ice Man. I was probably reading too much into it. I'll just continue to persevere, keep the faith, and hope that this is given a veto.

twinsmom · Post by **twinsmom** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 1:39 pm

I thought it was "interesting" that the Pro Gamasa article ran on Saturday...the day all of Tyrone receives a Daily Herald.

Ice Man · Post by **Ice Man** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 7:16 pm

twinsmom wrote:I thought it was "interesting" that the Pro Gamasa article ran on Saturday...the day all of Tyrone receives a Daily Herald.

I spoke with Kris Yaniello a few weeks ago and he told me that Gamesa's PR guy sends out press releases regarding Ice Mountain a couple times a week. Again, its paid professionals vs. local folks. NOT a level playing field.

My2Cents · Post by **My2Cents** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 8:13 pm

"Kris'"...I read your "In My Opinion" column in the Herald tonight. Congratulations, ya did good, and a great story... except, for the very last sentence. I'm glad you ended your story by asking a question.

I know My2Cents isn't worth a nickel, but, pleeeeeeazzzzzeee consider another name for your precious little girl. :slap: Somehow, "Gamesa" just doesn't sound like a Tyrone name.

GAM123 · Post by **GAM123** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 3:36 pm

Wanted to make sure you were aware of this week's poll in the website for Moorefield Examiner - a weekly paper published on Wednesday and covering Hardy Co., WV. The poll asks whether industrial wind turbines should be sited on public lands such as National Forest. The paper's website address is: http://www.moorefieldexaminer.com/ , and the poll is in upper right column of homepage.

Hey where's the Penguins icon???

My2Cents · Post by **My2Cents** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 4:47 pm

GAM123 wrote:Wanted to make sure you were aware of this week's poll in the website for Moorefield Examiner - a weekly paper published on Wednesday and covering Hardy Co., WV. The poll asks whether industrial wind turbines should be sited on public lands such as National Forest. The paper's website address is: http://www.moorefieldexaminer.com/ , and the poll is in upper right column of homepage.
Hey where's the Penguins icon???

The consensus of opinion so far, most think No they shouldn't be built anywhere !! I just don't understand it !!! Most people, by now, know the facts and the potential results once these things are allowed to be put in. It's not just here in our little corner-of-the-world... it's everywhere in the world now!! I am amazed as to how they were able to come thru back doors and put these things up before the public was even aware of what was happening. One thing for sure, they tried to come thru our back door AND it almost worked last fall. Now, with all their propaganda they are brazen enough to just come thru the front door. They are on a mission !!! What a shame if we fall for this one !!! 30 years??!! What a joke !!! What a waste !!!

Bill Latchford · Post by **Bill Latchford** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 10:40 pm

Did anyone notice the Wal-Mart add towards the end of the Price Is Right tonight? It was an add stating that if all the Wal-Mart shoppers would buy a carton of the green capped Silk (Soy Milk) that would be enough Wind Energy to power all of America's homes for 2 days or something like that. I have to review the add some more. If people buy the green capped Silk they will make a donation in support of Wind Energy. Their site also states that Silk offsets 100% of its electricity used in production with renewable Wind Energy. These are pretty bold statements and endorsements. Here are some links to pictures I captured off their sites. Just wanted all who come to this forum to read about this topic to see that it is not just a Tyrone issue this is a world wide issue and that some must truly believe that every little bit helps. We can't be just a forum that shows the negative side of wind energy. Wind Energy has its place and even though many feel it is not for the Tyrone area, some do feel that there is a benefit.

Here is the link from Wal-Mart's site:

http://www.geocities.com/utinker1/wal_silk.jpg

And here is the one from Silk's site:

http://www.geocities.com/utinker1/silk_green.jpg

banksy · Post by **banksy** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 11:36 pm

Wind Energy has a place.. where the wind blows more than 30% of the time.

80cobra · Post by **80cobra** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 2:01 am

I lived up Decker hollow for 19 years and have worked up there for the past 17 years and I can tell you the wind blows more than 30 % of the time. Ive read alot of things on this thread and try to keep an open mind not for or against the wind mills .Just trying to make up my own mind. Im going to take another trip to Blue Knob area to see them first hand again. I rode out there in the summer last year and stood about 400 ft away from one that was working, I could'nt here any noise, but I want to go back out there and look at them again, farther away and see how much noise they make. Then i'll make up my mind about them.I dont like to be force fed other peoples opinions for or against with out doing some research for myself.I think more people should take the objective aproach.The reason I said about the winds in Decker Hollow is because the residents up there will be directly affected by the windmills.No other residents are as close to the windmill sites.

Ice Man · Post by **Ice Man** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:08 am

Bill Latchford wrote:Did anyone notice the Wal-Mart add towards the end of the Price Is Right tonight? It was an add stating that if all the Wal-Mart shoppers would buy a carton of the green capped Silk (Soy Milk) that would be enough Wind Energy to power all of America's homes for 2 days or something like that. I have to review the add some more. If people buy the green capped Silk they will make a donation in support of Wind Energy. Their site also states that Silk offsets 100% of its electricity used in production with renewable Wind Energy. These are pretty bold statements and endorsements. Here are some links to pictures I captured off their sites. Just wanted all who come to this forum to read about this topic to see that it is not just a Tyrone issue this is a world wide issue and that some must truly believe that every little bit helps. We can't be just a forum that shows the negative side of wind energy. Wind Energy has its place and even though many feel it is not for the Tyrone area, some do feel that there is a benefit.

Here is the link from Wal-Mart's site:

http://www.geocities.com/utinker1/wal_silk.jpg

And here is the one from Silk's site:

http://www.geocities.com/utinker1/silk_green.jpg

The issue for the borough isn't the future of industrial windplants on Earth. The issue is whether Ice Mountain, a unique County Natural Heritage Area of exceptional conservation value (Blair County Natural Heritage Inventory), should be converted into an industrial windplant. I find it mind-numbing that you, after so much information has been provided, still have no respect for the results of the Blair County Natural Heritage Inventory.

Ice Man · Post by **Ice Man** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:28 am

80cobra wrote:I lived up Decker hollow for 19 years and have worked up there for the past 17 years and I can tell you the wind blows more than 30 % of the time. Ive read alot of things on this thread and try to keep an open mind not for or against the wind mills .Just trying to make up my own mind. Im going to take another trip to Blue Knob area to see them first hand again. I rode out there in the summer last year and stood about 400 ft away from one that was working, I could'nt here any noise, but I want to go back out there and look at them again, farther away and see how much noise they make. Then i'll make up my mind about them.I dont like to be force fed other peoples opinions for or against with out doing some research for myself.I think more people should take the objective aproach.The reason I said about the winds in Decker Hollow is because the residents up there will be directly affected by the windmills.No other residents are as close to the windmill sites.

So no one ever hikes or hunts on Ice Mountain? Only residents who live nearby need to be concerned?

Did you attend the SAVE ICE MOUNTAIN public forum?

I suggest that you pm InMyBackYard regarding the noise issue. She lives at the Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm. Her husband, Dr. Todd Stull, and ex-Juniata Township Supervisor Clair Chappell spoke about their experiences with the windplant at the SAVE ICE MOUNTAIN FORUM. Do a search for some of InMyBackYard's posts.

Here's another noise testimonial:

Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines
by Bill Latchford on Sat Dec 08, 2007 11:08 pm

As much as I didn't want to pop back in here I just had to....I spent 5 hours today walking through snow and knocking on doors up in the Portage / Blue Knob area. If my mind weren't already made up it is most certainly solidified now. At every stop of my ride through the Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm...There was not one point where I could not hear them. At some times ever so faint and at the worst of times it made me pity the people whom have to suffer with the Wind Turbines. I put around 12-18 miles on my car in just this area. I spoke to several people and did not ask their names. I wanted them to know what I was doing and did not want them to feel I would expose them to the media or the like. I will tell you that in some spots where I did not see the turbines because of the fog, I could hear them even better. Some people will say that you can hear them because you can see their movement, sort of a psychological thing. But guess what I could not see them because of the fog and the noise was there...My last stop was a very interesting and pleasant surprise. I introduced myself and the person said she knew me, because of the posts on here. I should add that before she answered the door, I was just amazed at how these things towered over the mountain in front of their home. Then to hear them was so surreal. It really does sound like a jet plane circling overhead. I thought it was an exaggeration, until I heard it myself. Then the blades start to pitch and turn into the wind again to make the best of the blowing winds and you can hear the metal to metal adjustments and then as the blades pitch and they thump through the air until they are in position. Then after all that you are back to the jet plane effect. Now while I was there I was expressing my pity that they have to put up with that, only to find out this was a calm day in comparison to how it can get. Even though the Turbine slated for Tyrone are decently far away from Tyrone proper, I feel it would be a serious disservice to our Snyder Township neighbors to let this go through. I was everywhere from 2000 feet to 1.2 miles maybe a touch further in some cases and could hear these giants. Though I am one who thinks they look majestic blowing in the wind. I for one will take this as a hindsight is 20/20 test and not put our citizens or Snyder Townships citizens through such an ordeal that these folks up in Portage / Blue knob area are going through. All is fine in our community now, let’s just leave things well alone and learn from other's misfortune. My many many heartfelt thanks to those who shared their day and time, and property with me today. I learned a great deal and will certainly ask all other Council Members here in Tyrone to make another trip to hear these Giants from a distance. I have an open invitation and I certainly hope I can get some of the other Council Members up there. Thanks "InMyBackYard"Bill Latchford
http://www.protectchildrenonline.org
Bill Latchford

http://www.windaction.org/news/13164 Borough Council VP Bill Latchford sits down for a Q & A about Gamesa's proposed wind farm on Ice Mountain

What is your main concern right now with a wind farm on Ice Mountain?

My main concern would be the noise levels of the wind mills, based on the noise problem at the Allegheny Ridge project right now. Gamesa doesn't say there's not a problem, they admit there is a problem and they're working on it, but until they get that problem fixed, I'm pretty much a "no" until I hear that.[color]

Regarding banksy's 30% comment, it reflects a common misconception that because industrial windplants in PA operate at an annuallized capacity of 30%, they operate only 30% of the time. That is not the case. It simply means that they produce only 30% of the electricity that they are capable of producing because the winds in PA aren't strong enough. Please realize that this results in an extremely inefficient use of resources. All the transmission lines, substations, etc need to be built to handle those times when the wind is blowing hard and the turbines are producing 100% of capacity, but this occurs only rarely!

Bill Latchford · Post by **Bill Latchford** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:50 am

IceMan - I totally stand by my comment about the Wind Turbines and the noise they are producing, but I truly believe that it is a unique installation where Mr. Chappell and Dr. Stull live. I think that that was just down and out bad sitting without the consideration of how the configuration would affect those directly down that hollow.
In regards to my last post, that was just to point out that I saw a commercial in prime time that supported Wind Energy. If you go to:

http://www.walmart.com/green

You will see what all Wal-Mart is doing to lower its Carbon Footprint...Some may say a little to late, because of the installed base of Wal-Mart’s all over the place, but just think if Wal-Mart would retrofit present stores with alternatives. Now that to me would be a significant effort on their part to help the environment. I believe all should email them about this and try to sway them to do that. The commercial talks about all 200,000,000 customers can make a difference by just buying "SILK Milk", those same customers should be asking Wal-Mart to be more environmentally friendly. I think it is a great idea to take advantage of alternative energy at a personal level as much as on an industrial level. Some talk about how we wont see any benefits personally from a Wind Plant on "Ice Mountain", but if individuals would take advantage, and if the Government would help the individual out as much as they help the developers then I think we could see personally the effects and benefits of using alternatives. I did just receive an email from the Governor's office stating that there is help on the way for individuals in regards to a 50% rebate program for qualified installs of alternatives for personal use. I think it said it just has to pass the Senate now.

80cobra · Post by **80cobra** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 9:34 am

Ice man I didnt attend the public forum didnt see any point because I read this thread every couple of days and between you sandstone and a couple of others post I say most of the things covered there are on here besides I run my own business and cant always take time out because i work alot of evenings .Second of all I think the people who live closest to the windmills are the most important issue then you should take in account the other issues in that order.Third as I said I read alot of things but dont like to be force fed your opinion.Let me make up my own mind.It seems that if someone trys to be objective about this you get real defensive,you are invovled for your own reasons, I understand . Also yes I've hunted hiked and even 4 wheeled and rode snow mobiles up there before it was illegal. I even camped up at the head of sink run with my sons when they were younger, unforgetable weekend.The wind is very strong as I said I can attest to that. You got to remember you live in the USA everyone is entitled their opinion not always the right one but dont hate them for it, the world would be a boring place if we all thought alike