Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

[Bill Latchford]

As I mentioned earlier, I found out what the output of Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm was. I went to:

http://www.ferc.gov/docs-filing/eqr/dat ... dsheet.asp

I input the time period I wanted to look at and the company I wanted to view. It takes me to 2 worksheets that were interesting to look at. Here is my findings:

According to these files, Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm produced 50,369 MWH in 4th quarter 2007. That sounds pretty significant to me.

The Limerick nuclear plant outside Philly generated 5,000,000 MWH during the same time period.
It serves 2,000,000 homes.

More importantly, however, it generates this amount CONSISTENTLY, and WHEN NEEDED.

It operates at close to 100% of capacity.

It's annuallized ouput is the equivalent of that produced by 4,000 industrial-scale wind turbines.

Compare quarterly generation stats for windfarms for consistency.

For more info on the Limerick plant and its benefits check

http://www.exeloncorp.com/ourcompanies/ ... tation.htm

http://www.exeloncorp.com/NR/rdonlyres/ ... et2007.pdf

Limerick Generating Station has approximately 700 permanent employees, and retains additional contractors as needed. The majority of Limerick’s employees live in Berks, Chester, and Montgomery counties. The station's annual payroll is approximately $62 million. Additionally, during refuel outages, Limerick employs almost 1,200 temporary contractors, who boost the local economy during their stay.

Exelon pays federal, state, and local income and real estate taxes totaling more than $15 million every year to support governments, area schools, libraries, park districts and other taxing bodies. Spending by the Limerick plant in Montgomery County totaled $43 million in 2004. The expenditures represented 17.5 percent of Limerick’s total spending of $246.7 million and 36.7 percent of the $117.2 million spent in Pennsylvania.

Thanks for the great Apples to Apples comparison...My point is that it was productive. Nothing was intended that it was anything comparable to a Nuclear facility. But hey I would not have expected anything less...Can't wait for the "Save Ice Mountain" public forum. :thumb:

[Ice Man]

As I mentioned earlier, I found out what the output of Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm was. I went to:

http://www.ferc.gov/docs-filing/eqr/dat ... dsheet.asp

I input the time period I wanted to look at and the company I wanted to view. It takes me to 2 worksheets that were interesting to look at. Here is my findings:

According to these files, Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm produced 50,369 MWH in 4th quarter 2007. That sounds pretty significant to me.

The Limerick nuclear plant outside Philly generated 5,000,000 MWH during the same time period.
It serves 2,000,000 homes.

More importantly, however, it generates this amount CONSISTENTLY, and WHEN NEEDED.

It operates at close to 100% of capacity.

It's annuallized ouput is the equivalent of that produced by 4,000 industrial-scale wind turbines.

Compare quarterly generation stats for windfarms for consistency.

For more info on the Limerick plant and its benefits check

http://www.exeloncorp.com/ourcompanies/ ... tation.htm

http://www.exeloncorp.com/NR/rdonlyres/ ... et2007.pdf

Limerick Generating Station has approximately 700 permanent employees, and retains additional contractors as needed. The majority of Limerick’s employees live in Berks, Chester, and Montgomery counties. The station's annual payroll is approximately $62 million. Additionally, during refuel outages, Limerick employs almost 1,200 temporary contractors, who boost the local economy during their stay.

Exelon pays federal, state, and local income and real estate taxes totaling more than $15 million every year to support governments, area schools, libraries, park districts and other taxing bodies. Spending by the Limerick plant in Montgomery County totaled $43 million in 2004. The expenditures represented 17.5 percent of Limerick’s total spending of $246.7 million and 36.7 percent of the $117.2 million spent in Pennsylvania.

Thanks for the great Apples to Apples comparison...My point is that it was productive. Nothing was intended that it was anything comparable to a Nuclear facility. But hey I would not have expected anything less...Can't wait for the "Save Ice Mountain" public forum. :thumb:

If we attach generators to all the treadmills at our local exercise clubs, then we could be productive too!

Howabout attaching a generator to your hamster wheel?

[Bill Latchford]

This is the latest poll information from Centre Daily Times Web Site about the Wind Farm at Sandy Ridge:

[sandstone]

I pray that we may see a story similar to that below in an upcoming edition of the Mirror or the Herald:

Fayette zoning board denies windpower proposal
By Amy Zalar, Herald-Standard
02/22/2008
Updated 02/22/2008 12:15:46 AM EST

The Fayette County Zoning Hearing Board has unanimously denied a special exception request that would have allowed the construction of 18 wind-powered turbines in Georges and Springhill townships.

Calling the decision the "hardest the board has had to make," board Chairman Jim Killinger issued a statement saying the choice to deny the special exception was made in the interest of Fayette County - its residents and for those who visit - while acknowledging the board cannot make everyone happy with its ruling.

The denial of a special exception for a wind-powered electricity generating facility and a variance from height and setback requirements affects a significant portion of a project through the Portland, Ore.-based PPM Atlantic Renewable Energy Corp. called the South Chestnut Windpower Project. The plan included construction of a total of 24 wind-powered turbines in Georges, Springhill and Wharton townships.

The six windmills in Wharton Township were not part of the county zoning board decision because Wharton Township has its owns zoning. The Wharton Township board previously gave approval for those windmills.

The denial was made Wednesday afternoon with Killinger, Janet Nelson and Mark Rafail voting against the request.

"All the board members have spent much time looking at all the issues from the petitioners and objectors. In doing so, the board's unanimous decision was applied to the zoning ordinance, case law, court decisions and the feelings of Fayette County residents," Killinger said.

"Our mountain is beautiful, pristine and full of protected and non-protected birds, bats and other animals," he continued. "We in Fayette County are the caretakers of our county and its wildlife. We are charged with this so future generations can enjoy what we have today which was passed down to use from past generations."

The windmills the board was being asked to approve harness the wind for electricity. Four days of testimony was held on the matter, and people both in favor of and against the project testified.

Those who testified included company officials and neighbors, as well as owners of Laurel Caverns, who expressed concern that locating the windmills at the site could potentially kill the entire bat population at the caverns.

All the windmills were to be located on land zoned A-1, agricultural/rural.

Samuel Enfield, development director of PPM's mid-Atlantic region, testified that the project included 3 1/2 miles along Chestnut Ridge on elevations between 2,400 and 2,760 feet on private property. He said the elevations in the area are the highest in the state, which makes the site a good fit for windmills. The towers are similar to ones built in Mill Run in 2001, but at 262 feet are 12 feet higher. The blades are 145 feet long, for a total height of 406 feet.

The zoning ordinance only allows 250-foot towers, which necessitates the special exception for the size. PPM also was requesting several variance requests for setbacks to be less than 262 feet.

Throughout testimony, property owners expressed concerns about noise and flickering from the turbines.

Although Enfield provided drawings reflecting how visible the windmills would be from five miles away during one day of testimony, Robert Adamovich suggested the windmills would be visible at much greater distances.

The owner of the historic Summit Inn in Uniontown said people visit the hotel for the view and to see the mountains.

"They want to see the mountains and not these windmills," said Karen Harris.

Larry Williams, who lives across the street from one of the proposed building sites for the windmills, and testified on two separate days, said he believes he will get flickering at his home.

He asked Enfield if anyone spoke to the people of Mill Run about the impact those windmills have had to the area. Williams said he spoke to a man who allowed a windmill to be constructed on his property and the man said he wished he hadn't.

"It's like that little community was tore apart," Williams said.

Another neighboring property owner expressed concerns about possible cancer risks and health problems for people and animals in close proximity to the windmills.

Others testified that they felt the windmills would be a benefit to the area.

Killinger said he personally spent hours daily going over files, notes from hearings and other issues presented to the board by everyone in favor of and against the request.

[sandstone]

Check out the latest migration map for the golden eagles in the National Aviary's telemetry study http://www.aviary.org/csrv/staticGolden.php

Right over Ice Mountain!

[Bill Latchford]

Check out the latest migration map for the golden eagles in the National Aviary's telemetry study http://www.aviary.org/csrv/staticGolden.php

Right over Ice Mountain!

- Very important graphic....that all should take into consideration. The very least a Wind Farm would do is cause an avoidance issue with for these Eagles...Keep in mind I said least...worst is that you kill every Eagle that wont avoid the Wind Farm. Now I have been told by The National Aviary that this migration corridor is 30 to 60 miles wide, that is also published on their web site. The graphic can be a bit misleading when you think of a raptor with a wing span of up to 7 feet flying up a migration corridor that is anywhere from 30 to 60 miles wide. So the graphic is making the trek look a bit wider than a raptor with only a 7 foot wing span. With 8 Eagle treks being depicted going through Central Pa. and knowing they could be anywhere in that 30 - 60 mile width some may think it is pretty hard for an Eagle to run into a Wind Farm. But keep in mind that it is said that The Allegheny Front, for which Ice Mountain is a part of, is still important to this migratory path. That leads to us wondering how big the Sandy Ridge Wind Farm might be physically? From looking over the Sound Study chart and understanding that this proposed Wind Farm falls between RT. 350 and RT 453 we can best guess it at, and this is I think over estimating it, 7 miles of ridge line and 3 miles deep. I really think that is an over estimate. If someone has a better guess I would be happy to see it. So we are talking about a migratory corridor that is 30 - 60 miles wide and an obstacle that is 7 by 3 miles within it. We are also talking about a migration that does not happen all at once so there would not be an issue of many raptors trying to fit through this "narrow" 30 - 60 mile corridor. Just by looking at the telemetry of these 8 raptors and the migration periods running from 6/10/2007 to 12/29/2007, one may assume that there would not be much congestion within this 30 - 60 mile corridor, even with a 7 X 3 mile Wind Farm in there somewhere. Now of course this is just me gabbing, and I will not lead anyone to believe I know what I am talking about when it comes to Raptor Migration or avoidance issues, I am just giving my observations and will certainly entertain any other thoughts on the topic.

[Something to say]

Yanno it just seems to me that the bottom line in this whole issue should be the wishes of the people of 16686. The property belongs to Tyrone....people have voiced their opinion....more people have came out against this wind farm than have come out to vote for public office...that should speak volumes to council. Statistics, others opinions, the whole issue of whether or not wind mills serve a purpose in the big scheme of things, what people in other areas are doing...and thinking....etc...etc...etc...shouldn't even be considered. The people who "own" the property known as ICE MOUNTAIN have said...NO to the windmills on Ice Mountain. Beat a horse beyond death. It's still a dead horse. You asked for a petition...you got it. People seem to care deeply about this...and yet for some reason some still find it necessary to ignore their wishes. I hope that Tyrone Citizens remember all of this in upcoming elections.

[My2Cents]

Yanno it just seems to me that the bottom line in this whole issue should be the wishes of the people of 16686. The property belongs to Tyrone....people have voiced their opinion....more people have came out against this wind farm than have come out to vote for public office...that should speak volumes to council. Statistics, others opinions, the whole issue of whether or not wind mills serve a purpose in the big scheme of things, what people in other areas are doing...and thinking....etc...etc...etc...shouldn't even be considered. The people who "own" the property known as ICE MOUNTAIN have said...NO to the windmills on Ice Mountain. Beat a horse beyond death. It's still a dead horse. You asked for a petition...you got it. People seem to care deeply about this...and yet for some reason some still find it necessary to ignore their wishes. I hope that Tyrone Citizens remember all of this in upcoming elections.

Right on !!! Thank goodness the people of Tyrone has several professionals speaking for them, with proof and backup... these people care deeply for our town and it's future. With these individuals, along with a community of people who have signed that petition... plus, many others who are now starting to listen and pay attention, the response is overwhelming and outstanding !!
Thank goodness a lease has not been signed yet.. I still think we should keep the faith in all of this. I just can't imagine our council allowing this to happen after all that has been proven along the way... not just here... elsewhere also.
For those of you who are just new to this board, or who have just started reading the posts.. please note that the comments, and ideas made above, by the council member are being made by him and he has some ties to this wind mill company. Needless to say, he has many reasons and/or excuses to be for this wind farm.. but, he is only one person from our council and he cannot vote on this very important subject when the time comes.

[cruiser1]

I just found this video clip about a high wind,wind turbine demise. Luckily no hydraulic oil got into their watershed-because they had sense enough not to build it on their watershed. Be prepared to be entertained.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=cdd_1203701257

[sandstone]

Check out the latest migration map for the golden eagles in the National Aviary's telemetry study http://www.aviary.org/csrv/staticGolden.php

Right over Ice Mountain!

- Very important graphic....that all should take into consideration. The very least a Wind Farm would do is cause an avoidance issue with for these Eagles...Keep in mind I said least...worst is that you kill every Eagle that wont avoid the Wind Farm. Now I have been told by The National Aviary that this migration corridor is 30 to 60 miles wide, that is also published on their web site. The graphic can be a bit misleading when you think of a raptor with a wing span of up to 7 feet flying up a migration corridor that is anywhere from 30 to 60 miles wide. So the graphic is making the trek look a bit wider than a raptor with only a 7 foot wing span. With 8 Eagle treks being depicted going through Central Pa. and knowing they could be anywhere in that 30 - 60 mile width some may think it is pretty hard for an Eagle to run into a Wind Farm. But keep in mind that it is said that The Allegheny Front, for which Ice Mountain is a part of, is still important to this migratory path. That leads to us wondering how big the Sandy Ridge Wind Farm might be physically? From looking over the Sound Study chart and understanding that this proposed Wind Farm falls between RT. 350 and RT 453 we can best guess it at, and this is I think over estimating it, 7 miles of ridge line and 3 miles deep. I really think that is an over estimate. If someone has a better guess I would be happy to see it. So we are talking about a migratory corridor that is 30 - 60 miles wide and an obstacle that is 7 by 3 miles within it. We are also talking about a migration that does not happen all at once so there would not be an issue of many raptors trying to fit through this "narrow" 30 - 60 mile corridor. Just by looking at the telemetry of these 8 raptors and the migration periods running from 6/10/2007 to 12/29/2007, one may assume that there would not be much congestion within this 30 - 60 mile corridor, even with a 7 X 3 mile Wind Farm in there somewhere. Now of course this is just me gabbing, and I will not lead anyone to believe I know what I am talking about when it comes to Raptor Migration or avoidance issues, I am just giving my observations and will certainly entertain any other thoughts on the topic.

Raptors migrating long distances need to conserve their energy. They therefore utilize favorable air currents as much as possible to avoid having to flap their wings. Early fall and late spring migrants use thermals, or pockets of warm air that rise off of ridge sides, to enable them to soar for long distances without flapping their wings. In late fall and early spring, migrating raptors use wind deflected off of ridge sides to give them lift for soaring. Golden eagles are late fall and early spring migrants. Their trek through PA peaks in November and March. They use the ridges, so, although the corridor through which they pass may be 60 miles wide, they pretty much stick to the ridges as much as possible because of the lift provided by the wind. These are the same areas coveted by windplant developers. That's why the Pennsylvania Game Commission has designated the Allegheny Front, Bald Eagle Ridge, Brush Mountain, and Tussey Mountain as high risk sites for industrial windplant development.

According to the National Aviary's Dr. Todd Katzner:

The size of the eastern North American population of golden eagles is small and therefore it is
highly vulnerable to demographic perturbations. In addition, golden eagles tend to migrate and
winter within areas in the central Appalachians that are currently under development or targeted
for future development by wind energy companies. This species commonly uses slope soaring
and ridge updrafts during migration and foraging, behaviors which are known to increase
collision risk (Barrios & Rodriguez, 2004; Hoover & Morrison, 2005). Finally, the species is
known to be highly susceptible to collision with some wind turbines (Hunt, 2002; Smallwood
& Thelander, 2004). Because of their demography, migration and winter flight behavior, and
high vulnerability to wind turbines, we consider eastern golden eagles to be the eastern US
species at highest risk of population-scale impacts from wind energy development.

http://www.aviary.org/csrv/WindEnergyRa ... ePaper.pdf

Also see http://ww2.lafayette.edu/~brandesd/Wind ... ersion.pdf

[sandstone]

I just found this video clip about a high wind,wind turbine demise. Luckily no hydraulic oil got into their watershed-because they had sense enough not to build it on their watershed. Be prepared to be entertained.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=cdd_1203701257

Such leaks are fairly common. Several hundred gallons were sprayed out of a turbine nacelle at Bear Creek in the Poconos last year.

[My2Cents]

I just found this video clip about a high wind,wind turbine demise. Luckily no hydraulic oil got into their watershed-because they had sense enough not to build it on their watershed. Be prepared to be entertained.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=cdd_1203701257

WHEW !!!

[sandstone]

I just found this video clip about a high wind,wind turbine demise. Luckily no hydraulic oil got into their watershed-because they had sense enough not to build it on their watershed. Be prepared to be entertained.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=cdd_1203701257

WHEW !!!

The Centre County Planning Commission asked me to give them a presentation on industrial windfarms and I did so last week, concentrating on ordinances governing windfarms. I also talked about the Sandy Ridge Wind Farm proposal, and, of course, they were only interested in the Centre County portion of the proposed windplant, but several of the Centre County Planning Commission members were surprised to learn that most of the Blair County portion of the windplant would be in a municipal water supply watershed. They couldn't believe that the borough would even consider such forest removal and development in a water supply area!

[Bill Latchford]

Raptors migrating long distances need to conserve their energy. They therefore utilize favorable air currents as much as possible to avoid having to flap their wings. Early fall and late spring migrants use thermals, or pockets of warm air that rise off of ridge sides, to enable them to soar for long distances without flapping their wings. In late fall and early spring, migrating raptors use wind deflected off of ridge sides to give them lift for soaring. Golden eagles are late fall and early spring migrants. Their trek through PA peaks in November and March. They use the ridges, so, although the corridor through which they pass may be 60 miles wide, they pretty much stick to the ridges as much as possible because of the lift provided by the wind. These are the same areas coveted by windplant developers. That's why the Pennsylvania Game Commission has designated the Allegheny Front, Bald Eagle Ridge, Brush Mountain, and Tussey Mountain as high risk sites for industrial windplant development.

According to the National Aviary's Dr. Todd Katzner:

The size of the eastern North American population of golden eagles is small and therefore it is
highly vulnerable to demographic perturbations. In addition, golden eagles tend to migrate and
winter within areas in the central Appalachians that are currently under development or targeted
for future development by wind energy companies. This species commonly uses slope soaring
and ridge updrafts during migration and foraging, behaviors which are known to increase
collision risk (Barrios & Rodriguez, 2004; Hoover & Morrison, 2005). Finally, the species is
known to be highly susceptible to collision with some wind turbines (Hunt, 2002; Smallwood
& Thelander, 2004). Because of their demography, migration and winter flight behavior, and
high vulnerability to wind turbines, we consider eastern golden eagles to be the eastern US
species at highest risk of population-scale impacts from wind energy development.

http://www.aviary.org/csrv/WindEnergyRa ... ePaper.pdf

Also see http://ww2.lafayette.edu/~brandesd/Wind ... ersion.pdf

Dr. Kotala...Thank you for the information...As I always have said the only stupid question is the one never asked...I asked and you provided great information. Like I said I have no experience with Migratory Raptors and am always glad to be educated.

[My2Cents]

By the way.... I meant to mention this last week. I only wish that folks of all ages could, and/or would, be computer savy enough to get into cyberspace... there is so much out there to learn. It's amazing how you can go to a map and zero right down onto an area and see exactly what the area looks like. Long story short, what I'm getting to... One of last Saturday's letter to the editor in the Tyrone Daily Herald was written by a lady who mentioned that she "chooses to cast her vote for the wind farm." She mentioned something about "two wind mills right smack in the town of Nantucket, MA"... "supplying all the power needed for the school and town buildings as well."
I can understand why she is thinking this way... if they have theirs in the middle of town, why can't we have ours up on Ice Mountain ?? She is also concerned with the fact our town has a huge elderly population and that we will find it difficult to live with water/sewer or tax increases and she believes a wind farm in this area will take care of all that.
I went to Nantucket, MA via cyberspace... in the search box, I put in,
"Nantucket, MA windmills"... what a surprise to see a lot of sites coming up to click onto. I was actually looking/trying to see, and/or find out, (to no avail), how big the wind mills were that were "smack in the middle of town." It was absolutely amazing to read some of those articles.... the people living there ,and around that area, are definitely not happy campers with them being put into that area. I haven't read all the articles, but, they are going thru the same thing that the folks in the areas below us are going thru.... they allowed the windmills to go up and now it's another case of it's too late now. I only wish that there were some way to show some of those articles to Ms. Wilson.... I truly feel she would would have second thoughts on this subject. The people in that area are heartbroken. They too are concerned with all that has happened to their beautiful scenery, the birds, and other wild life in that area. They actually have windmills scattered all over the sound up there.... what a shame.