Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

SoccerMom · Post by **SoccerMom** » Sat May 24, 2008 6:37 am

My2Cents wrote:Yes.... but, coming down 550 in Warriors Mark, (towards Tyrone by the way), mighty strange !!! Were they on a scenic tour of the countryside ?? 550 is not all that wide in some spots, there are a lot of curves, above all, there is a definite L curve to negotiate. I bet they don't try that again... and, if they do... there goes that nice newly macadamed back road to State College!!! That L will turn into a C in no time. This whole thing is getting to be ridiculous. These things are being made in Ebensburg... what are they doing way out there ?? Way out there and heading this way.....

My2cents, I wondered the same thing! Why they didn't stick to 99/220 is beyond me. I'm just glad I was heading the other direction and not behind them! 550 is definitely not the road these things should be transported on. If they're not smart enough to figure it out, I can just imagine what the construction of this wind farm is going to be like.

sandstone · Post by **sandstone** » Sat May 24, 2008 7:31 am

Bill Latchford wrote:
sandstone wrote:You stated repeatedly that you do not value our natural heritage. You went so far as to state that there is nothing unique or of exceptional conservation value about Ice Mountain. With those words you show your enormous disrespect for the Blair County Natural Heritage Inventory. That Inventory was done by professional ecologists working for the Blair County Planning Commission.
I have not once questioned the validity of the Natural Heritage Inventory. If you have that quote somewhere I would certainly love to see it.

Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines
by Ice Man on Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:24 pm

Bill Latchford wrote:

"I personally find nothing "Unique" and "Exceptional" about that mountain."

Bill Latchford · Post by **Bill Latchford** » Sat May 24, 2008 7:59 am

sandstone wrote:
Bill Latchford wrote:
sandstone wrote:You stated repeatedly that you do not value our natural heritage. You went so far as to state that there is nothing unique or of exceptional conservation value about Ice Mountain. With those words you show your enormous disrespect for the Blair County Natural Heritage Inventory. That Inventory was done by professional ecologists working for the Blair County Planning Commission.
I have not once questioned the validity of the Natural Heritage Inventory. If you have that quote somewhere I would certainly love to see it.
Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines
by Ice Man on Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:24 pm

Bill Latchford wrote:

"I personally find nothing "Unique" and "Exceptional" about that mountain."

The operative word there is "I” I don't see a question there...It is a statement about my personal thoughts of that mountain. I have been up there a few times and find it to be like any other mountain I have run around on. There are lots of them in this area. Now I will not doubt that the trained eye can see what I do not. You know what you want to look for up there and see things from a different view. I do not squash your thoughts on the mountain. Remember beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think it is a nice mountain...but no nicer than any of the others. I appreciate your position, but I don't have to agree with it. Thanks again.

My2Cents · Post by **My2Cents** » Sat May 24, 2008 9:07 am

:wall:... pitiful !!

Something to say · Post by **Something to say** » Sat May 24, 2008 9:54 am

Bill Latchford wrote:
sandstone wrote:You stated repeatedly that you do not value our natural heritage. You went so far as to state that there is nothing unique or of exceptional conservation value about Ice Mountain. With those words you show your enormous disrespect for the Blair County Natural Heritage Inventory. That Inventory was done by professional ecologists working for the Blair County Planning Commission.
Dr. Kotala - I have stated repeatedly that I do not share your, or some of the other persons on this threads, passion for nature. I have not once questioned the validity of the Natural Heritage Inventory. How can I? I am not an expert...I can only speak to my views on the topic. If you have that quote somewhere I would certainly love to see it. I in no way shape or form have to share your views, or any one else's for that matter...This is what is called free will, which I am exercising. I most certainly have taken your viewpoint into consideration, but I don't have to make your view my view. Be happy you have had so many jump on your cause. It is something to be proud of.

Right there it is...that statement...the type of things you say that outrage so many people. Although I certainly respect Sandstone's RESEARCH... I have formed an opinion all by myself. Jumping on his cause...bandwagon effect...pffft. I, maybe unlike you, make my own judgements and decisions in life...based on many things, but I have never jumped on anything because of the belief held by someone else.

And as far as you not questioning the validity of the Natural Heritage Inventory... you certainly have. It's implied. If ANYONE votes yes to the windfarm on Ice Mountain...then they have no respect for that inventory, since that inventory suggests that windfarm is detrimental to Ice Mountain. YOU TALK OUT OF BOTH SIDES OF YOUR MOUTH.

Bill Latchford · Post by **Bill Latchford** » Sat May 24, 2008 10:08 am

Something to say wrote:
Bill Latchford wrote:
sandstone wrote:You stated repeatedly that you do not value our natural heritage. You went so far as to state that there is nothing unique or of exceptional conservation value about Ice Mountain. With those words you show your enormous disrespect for the Blair County Natural Heritage Inventory. That Inventory was done by professional ecologists working for the Blair County Planning Commission.
Dr. Kotala - I have stated repeatedly that I do not share your, or some of the other persons on this threads, passion for nature. I have not once questioned the validity of the Natural Heritage Inventory. How can I? I am not an expert...I can only speak to my views on the topic. If you have that quote somewhere I would certainly love to see it. I in no way shape or form have to share your views, or any one else's for that matter...This is what is called free will, which I am exercising. I most certainly have taken your viewpoint into consideration, but I don't have to make your view my view. Be happy you have had so many jump on your cause. It is something to be proud of.

Right there it is...that statement...the type of things you say that outrage so many people. Although I certainly respect Sandstone's RESEARCH... I have formed an opinion all by myself. Jumping on his cause...bandwagon effect...pffft. I, maybe unlike you, make my own judgements and decisions in life...based on many things, but I have never jumped on anything because of the belief held by someone else.

And as far as you not questioning the validity of the Natural Heritage Inventory... you certainly have. It's implied. If ANYONE votes yes to the windfarm on Ice Mountain...then they have no respect for that inventory, since that inventory suggests that windfarm is detrimental to Ice Mountain. YOU TALK OUT OF BOTH SIDES OF YOUR MOUTH.

"Some Thing To Say" - I have formed my own opinion on the grounds of what I want to make my decision based upon...Just because we have a difference of opinion does not make either of us right. I will say that you almost make sense with your Natural Heritage Inventory comment but it is based on feelings. I think a Wind Farm will do good, you think it will do bad...It will be a never ending saga...I respect the people who have worked hard to do this Inventory, but that does not mean I have to do as they say. Now I am saying that because as far as I know and understand this Inventory and things like this are not binding as laws and such. Are they not to be taken as recommendations? I don't know the answer so maybe Dr. Kotala can chime in and let me know if what was handed down by the Blair County Planning Commission was something that was binding or was it a recommendation?

Something to say · Post by **Something to say** » Sat May 24, 2008 10:18 am

Bill Latchford wrote:
Something to say wrote:
Bill Latchford wrote:
sandstone wrote:You stated repeatedly that you do not value our natural heritage. You went so far as to state that there is nothing unique or of exceptional conservation value about Ice Mountain. With those words you show your enormous disrespect for the Blair County Natural Heritage Inventory. That Inventory was done by professional ecologists working for the Blair County Planning Commission.
Dr. Kotala - I have stated repeatedly that I do not share your, or some of the other persons on this threads, passion for nature. I have not once questioned the validity of the Natural Heritage Inventory. How can I? I am not an expert...I can only speak to my views on the topic. If you have that quote somewhere I would certainly love to see it. I in no way shape or form have to share your views, or any one else's for that matter...This is what is called free will, which I am exercising. I most certainly have taken your viewpoint into consideration, but I don't have to make your view my view. Be happy you have had so many jump on your cause. It is something to be proud of.

Right there it is...that statement...the type of things you say that outrage so many people. Although I certainly respect Sandstone's RESEARCH... I have formed an opinion all by myself. Jumping on his cause...bandwagon effect...pffft. I, maybe unlike you, make my own judgements and decisions in life...based on many things, but I have never jumped on anything because of the belief held by someone else.

And as far as you not questioning the validity of the Natural Heritage Inventory... you certainly have. It's implied. If ANYONE votes yes to the windfarm on Ice Mountain...then they have no respect for that inventory, since that inventory suggests that windfarm is detrimental to Ice Mountain. YOU TALK OUT OF BOTH SIDES OF YOUR MOUTH.
"Some Thing To Say" - I have formed my own opinion on the grounds of what I want to make my decision based upon...Just because we have a difference of opinion does not make either of us right. I will say that you almost make sense with your Natural Heritage Inventory comment but it is based on feelings. I think a Wind Farm will do good, you think it will do bad...It will be a never ending saga...I respect the people who have worked hard to do this Inventory, but that does not mean I have to do as they say. Now I am saying that because as far as I know and understand this Inventory and things like this are not binding as laws and such. Are they not to be taken as recommendations? I don't know the answer so maybe Dr. Kotala can chime in and let me know if what was handed down by the Blair County Planning Commission was something that was binding or was it a recommendation?

Mr. Latchford, do you hear yourself when you think? Please LOOK at what you just said. If I may use an example...

The Surgeon General's Warning : Cigarette Smoke Contains Carbon Monoxide. Smoking by pregnant women may result in premature birth, and low birth weight.

NOW... I may not agree with that, and according to you...that makes neither of us ( me or the surgeon general right) ????

My feelings may be... pi$$ on the surgeon general... I enjoy smoking. THAT DOES NOT HOWEVER MEAN THAT THE SURGEON GENERAL HAS NO KNOWLEDGE OF THE HAZARDS OF SMOKING CIGARETTES. RESEARCH.... MUCH RESEARCH...has been done. Cigarette smoking is detrimental to one's health. WINDFARM ON ICE MOUNTAIN...DETRIMENTAL TO ICE MOUNTAIN. Choose to ignore it if you wish.......but stop arguing the fact that just because you dont' see it it ain't so. IT IS. PERIOD.

AND as I said before ...If it wasn't for the fact that I know Tyrone will in the long run....pay for this mistake .... I almost want it to happen so I can sit back and gloat.

Something to say · Post by **Something to say** » Sat May 24, 2008 10:22 am

Bill Latchford said, "Now I am saying that because as far as I know and understand this Inventory and things like this are not binding as laws and such. Are they not to be taken as recommendations? I don't know the answer so maybe Dr. Kotala can chime in and let me know if what was handed down by the Blair County Planning Commission was something that was binding or was it a recommendation?

what????? Binding as laws? It's a recommendation obviously... Research has been done....like sandstone said in his previous post... Professional ecologists have determined.... The sad thing is this... Due to that research....you would think....the community would uphold it's findings and honor them. Shouldn't even be Questioned. SHEEEEEEEESH.

Bill Latchford · Post by **Bill Latchford** » Sat May 24, 2008 10:35 am

Something to say wrote:Bill Latchford said, "Now I am saying that because as far as I know and understand this Inventory and things like this are not binding as laws and such. Are they not to be taken as recommendations? I don't know the answer so maybe Dr. Kotala can chime in and let me know if what was handed down by the Blair County Planning Commission was something that was binding or was it a recommendation?

what????? Binding as laws? It's a recommendation obviously... Research has been done....like sandstone said in his previous post... Professional ecologists have determined.... The sad thing is this... Due to that research....you would think....the community would uphold it's findings and honor them. Shouldn't even be Questioned. SHEEEEEEEESH.

Point Understood....I should put it differently...When I say I don't agree....I don't mean I don't agree with the professionals...How can I possibly contest them...They have dedicated their lives to Ecology and such...I just mean that I don't share their same thoughts and passions for all things natural. I care just not as much as they do. I don't litter I conserve electricity, I recycle, I ride my bike when possible... everyone does their own part to help the world even if it is in a small way at least it is an effort.

Something to say · Post by **Something to say** » Sat May 24, 2008 10:40 am

Gotcha...and I don't want to fight with you... I'm just trying to make my point clearly. Here's the thing... you do all you do to conserve...and that's great, but if a group of professionals research and their findings say that something will have a negative effect on the conservation value of a specific...and you go against that... then all you've done to conserve is meaningless. Robbing Peter to pay Paul. Nature... is a circle. Disrupt that circle...break it...and it no longer functions properly. Does that make any sense to you? We're not just talking trees and animals here...we're talking about a group of things that work together. The Circle of Life. We all play an intricate part... .human, animal, plant. In that role...negative manipulation of any of those parts...is detrimental to our well-being.

My2Cents · Post by **My2Cents** » Sat May 24, 2008 10:40 am

Do your own "research." He shouldn't have to answer any of your questions. What you should do, instead of doing all your so-called, "leg work, research, and decision making," you should take your handy-dandy little GPS tracker, find a mountainside, (if you can), sit down, relax, and read a good book about nature. While you are at it, take in and listen to the sounds around you... the birds, the bees, the flowers and the trees... It is amazing what God has created and man, with thoughts such as yours, is trying to destroy.
You are not going to be voting on this subject because of your "conflict of interest." We still are hoping for the best outcome here. We need this board and each other. We do not need you stepping in here trying to stir a pot that does not need stirred at this point. We absolutely do not want Rick to step in here and close this board on us. You have tried this before and here you go again.

Bill Latchford · Post by **Bill Latchford** » Sat May 24, 2008 10:44 am

Something to say wrote:Mr. Latchford, do you hear yourself when you think? Please LOOK at what you just said. If I may use an example...

The Surgeon General's Warning : Cigarette Smoke Contains Carbon Monoxide. Smoking by pregnant women may result in premature birth, and low birth weight.

NOW... I may not agree with that, and according to you...that makes neither of us ( me or the surgeon general right) ????

My feelings may be... pi$$ on the surgeon general... I enjoy smoking. THAT DOES NOT HOWEVER MEAN THAT THE SURGEON GENERAL HAS NO KNOWLEDGE OF THE HAZARDS OF SMOKING CIGARETTES. RESEARCH.... MUCH RESEARCH...has been done. Cigarette smoking is detrimental to one's health. WINDFARM ON ICE MOUNTAIN...DETRIMENTAL TO ICE MOUNTAIN. Choose to ignore it if you wish.......but stop arguing the fact that just because you dont' see it it ain't so. IT IS. PERIOD.

AND as I said before ...If it wasn't for the fact that I know Tyrone will in the long run....pay for this mistake .... I almost want it to happen so I can sit back and gloat.

The object here is not who is right or wrong, but how people put weight on the topic...All I am saying is that I don't share the professionals passionate attitude on this particular subject...It's not a matter of right or wrong....I can't make that determination since I am not a professional Ecologist. I give them their credit....They worked hard to get to where they are. At the same time I don't have to share their opinion. Just because someone is a professional (College Degree or Not) doesn’t mean that all professionals are right or that you have to agree with them. Remember we all have free will and we choose where and when to exercise it.

Something to say · Post by **Something to say** » Sat May 24, 2008 10:50 am

Oh Bill... you're never going agree with what I say because you have made up your mind. You cannot say I haven't made sense in my posts...or that others haven't. You and I both know the reason council is even considering this. All I can say to you at this point is Good Luck. I fear for your town.... truly. God gave man dominion over this world...and we surely have taken advantage of it. Raping and plundering and not giving back. Now we are sowing what we reaped and keep doing just as we want for the almighty green. I fear for us all. Whatever.

Bill Latchford · Post by **Bill Latchford** » Sat May 24, 2008 10:56 am

My2Cents wrote: It is amazing what God has created and man, with thoughts such as yours, is trying to destroy.

As long as this statement is all inclusive to human beings in general I have no argument with it. I know there are people on this board that are using electricity right now, and that dirve on I-99 and that use cell phones..etc...we all play a role at destroying what God has given to us so freely. So don't just say "with thoughts such as yours" without including yourself in this group. "One Human Race" we all belong to it and we all are responsible for the shape our planet is in. It will take a lot of work to turn things around but It just takes an effort to get the ball rolling back in the right direction.

Something to say · Post by **Something to say** » Sat May 24, 2008 11:10 am

Bill Latchford wrote:
My2Cents wrote: It is amazing what God has created and man, with thoughts such as yours, is trying to destroy.
As long as this statement is all inclusive to human beings in general I have no argument with it. I know there are people on this board that are using electricity right now, and that dirve on I-99 and that use cell phones..etc...we all play a role at destroying what God has given to us so freely. So don't just say "with thoughts such as yours" without including yourself in this group. "One Human Race" we all belong to it and we all are responsible for the shape our planet is in. It will take a lot of work to turn things around but It just takes an effort to get the ball rolling back in the right direction.

Can I assume that right direction includes the windfarm? lol... again... no respect for the Inventory and their findings. Not gonna sit and argue Bill. I have things to do today... see ya on the flipside.