Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

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Ice Man
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by Ice Man »

sandstone wrote:
80cobra wrote:Sandman do you have any comments about the letter Terry Hyde wrote in The Herald on saturday.
I just finished a 4-year term as president of Juniata Valley Audubon, a 40-year-old chapter of the National Audubon Society, which is close to 100 years old. Our chapter has 450 members. I now serve as its conservation chair. Terry Wentz is the new president of Juniata Valley Audubon.

My comment regarding Mr. Hyde's (or Dr. Jekyll's) "information" is the same as the comment you made above: "Let's focus on the original issue." Mr. Hyde's only reference to industrial windfarms was his claim that Audubon has not supported any industrial windplant proposal in PA. This is absurd and I'd like to know where he got that information. For example, 3 industrial windplants have been proposed in Blair County: Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm, Chestnut Flats Wind Farm, and Sandy Ridge Wind Farm. Juniata Valley Audubon did not oppose the Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm, does not oppose the proposed Chestnut Flats Wind Farm, but does oppose the proposed Sandy Ridge Wind Farm.
For newcomers who have not read the preceding 100 pages of this forum, it's important to note the reasons why some windplants are supported by Juniata Valley Audubon while others are opposed by Juniata Valley Audubon. Here's Juniata Valley Audubon's industrial windplant policy for Blair County, which was crafted by its board of directors in 2005: http://jvas.org/cc_lwfbc.html
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by sandstone »

Ice Man wrote:
sandstone wrote:
80cobra wrote:Sandman do you have any comments about the letter Terry Hyde wrote in The Herald on saturday.
I just finished a 4-year term as president of Juniata Valley Audubon, a 40-year-old chapter of the National Audubon Society, which is close to 100 years old. Our chapter has 450 members. I now serve as its conservation chair. Terry Wentz is the new president of Juniata Valley Audubon.

My comment regarding Mr. Hyde's (or Dr. Jekyll's) "information" is the same as the comment you made above: "Let's focus on the original issue." Mr. Hyde's only reference to industrial windfarms was his claim that Audubon has not supported any industrial windplant proposal in PA. This is absurd and I'd like to know where he got that information. For example, 3 industrial windplants have been proposed in Blair County: Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm, Chestnut Flats Wind Farm, and Sandy Ridge Wind Farm. Juniata Valley Audubon did not oppose the Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm, does not oppose the proposed Chestnut Flats Wind Farm, but does oppose the proposed Sandy Ridge Wind Farm.
For newcomers who have not read the preceding 100 pages of this forum, it's important to note the reasons why some windplants are supported by Juniata Valley Audubon while others are opposed by Juniata Valley Audubon. Here's Juniata Valley Audubon's industrial windplant policy for Blair County, which was crafted by its board of directors in 2005: http://jvas.org/cc_lwfbc.html
Many of the board members would like to see the policy strengthened because of the emerging data regarding the importance of the Allegheny Front to golden eagle migration http://www.aviary.org/csrv/staticGolden.php
and the increasing noise problems that would affect outdoor recreation (see Kay Stephens' reports in the Altoona Mirror or contact InMyBackYard).
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by 80cobra »

I looked at the map Gamesa has for the proposed wind farm 18 look to be on water shed property but the other 12 look to be on private property. Even if the borough decides not to lease the water shed to Gamesa what about the others? How do you stop private land owners from leasing their property? As I understand alot of the property at Blue Knob was private.
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by Bill Latchford »

I just heard on the news that a theory is out about why the bees are dying off. They are blaming it on air pollution from Cars and Power Plants. It is said that the pollution is masking the fragrance of the flowers and therefore the bees are having a heck of a time finding the plants and therefore cannot make food. I am trying to find a link on CBS's site for this theory.
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by Bill Latchford »

80cobra wrote:I looked at the map Gamesa has for the proposed wind farm 18 look to be on water shed property but the other 12 look to be on private property. Even if the borough decides not to lease the water shed to Gamesa what about the others? How do you stop private land owners from leasing their property? As I understand alot of the property at Blue Knob was private.
Cobra - It would be up to Gamesa if they thought it would still be worth it or not to build only around half of the plant. The private land issue could be an issue depending on what type of ordnances or restrictions Snyder Township would impose on the Wind Industry. I believe the Tyrone side is needed because of the access to The Grid. I am unaware of how accessible The Grid is on the private lands that are looking to erect the Wind Turbines.
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by SoccerMom »

There are many theories about why the honey bees are dying off, and most likely it is a result of several factors. One pathogen in particular, Israeli acute paralysis virus (IAPV), has appeared in almost every case, making it a prime suspect as the cause of the collapse, as a marker for some other cause, or perhaps as the last straw that broke the back of already highly stressed colonies.

“This is a complicated problem with so many variables,” says Diana Cox-Foster, professor of Entomology at Penn State, “and we need to quantify what is happening. IAPV may be a factor because mites suppress the bees’ immune system and make them more susceptible to disease. Worldwide, 19 bee diseases have been described, and we don’t know how many others might be out there.”

To determine if IAPV is the cause or one of many stressors working together, researchers will try to re-create a collapse in a controlled environment. “We’re using healthy bees from Hawaii produced especially for this research,” says Cox-Foster. “We have to be certain they are ‘clean’ bees, don’t have varroa mites, and have not been treated with miticides.” Scientists are exposing these test colonies to IAPV in controlled greenhouse environments to study the virus’ effect.

Fungi are being looked at as well. Since early samples showed high levels of fungi in CCD colonies, the research team asked Penn State mycologist David Geiser to join the investigation. “You could see that there were a lot of fungi on the bees,” says Geiser. “The big question was whether fungi are the ultimate cause or playing a significant role in CCD.” Right now, researchers don’t believe fungi are the cause of CCD but instead are opportunistic threats that appear in already weak colonies.

On pollination jobs, bees come into contact with a variety of insecticides, fungicides, and herbicides used on crops. While scientists don’t think pesticides are the sole cause of CCD, they believe chemicals contribute to the problem. Extension bee specialist Maryann Frazier is collaborating with pesticide toxicologist Chris Mullin and insect physiologist Jim Frazier to investigate the link between pesticides and the general decline in honey bees. “We tested samples of honey bee pollen—the food for young, developing bees—and found a pretty broad range of substances, including insecticides, fungicides, and herbicides,” says Maryann Frazier.

One class of pesticides under close scrutiny by beekeepers and the press are neonicotinoids, which are known to be quite toxic to honey bees. Mullin believes a broader look is needed. “We're seeing a large sweep of active pesticides in pollen,” he says. “Some are ingredients still in commercial use, others are residues from products that have been canceled. We’re screening for at least 175 active ingredients.”

Contaminated or not, pollen is the nutritional lifeblood of bees, but thanks to habitat changes, they aren’t eating as well as they once did. An agricultural and suburban landscape ethos focusing on the removal of weeds as well as fencerows and other areas that once offered diverse and continual pollen sources has almost eliminated natural food for bees. As a result, beekeepers must artificially feed their bees between pollination jobs.

“A beautiful green lawn is a desert to a bee,” Frazier points out. “So are farmlands without weeded hedgerows and fallow fields. This affects wild pollinators as well; butterflies, moths, bumblebees, and other insects that pollinate also are in decline.”
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by SoccerMom »

This was just published today on the American Beekeeping Federation's web site:

http://www.abfnet.org/node/41

CCD May Be Linked To Virus From Australia, Scientists Say; ABF Seeks Moratorium On Imports

The determination that Colony Collapse Disorder might be linked to a virus imported with Australian bees has caused the ABF Board of Directors to call for a moratorium on the imports. In a letter to Cindy J. Smith, administrator of USDA’s Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service, the ABF asked that imports be suspended until a survey can be completed to determine what honey bee pests and pathogens exist in the United States and until scientists determine that restarting imports would present no hazards to U.S. honey bee health. American Honey Producers Assn. sent APHIS a similar request.

The possible link of CCD and the Israeli Acute Paralysis Virus (IAPV) was revealed in articles by Science magazine in its online edition, Science Express, on Sept. 6, and in its print edition on Sept. 7. The authors of the scientific report have been careful to say they have not proven that IAPV causes CCD, nor that the Australian imports introduced IAPV to the United States.

IAPV was first reported in Israel in 2004. At presstime, it was not clear how long the virus has been known in Australian bees, but Australian bee experts say no ill effects of the virus have been seen there.

The U.S. researchers reported in Science that IAPV was found in all of the four CCD-affected apiaries in their test and in the one sample from a healthy package of Australian bees, but in neither of the two non-CCD apiaries tested. They also tested royal jelly imported from China and found IAPV in two of those samples. “Either [the packages from Australia or the royal jelly from China] may have served as potential points of entry into the U.S., with the Australian packages being more likely,” Diana Cox-Foster said in an email message to industry leaders. Dr. Cox-Foster, of Penn State University and the lead researcher on the project, noted: “Further research is required to say exactly from where the virus originated and how it spreading and changing (mutating) as it moves.”

Looking ahead, Dr. Cox-Foster said, “The next phase of research needs to test whether or not IAPV is a direct causal agent of CCD or just a really good marker for CCD [an organism found only in CCD colonies]. In either case, we do believe that detection of IAPV will be important in determining the probability that colonies are apt to undergo CCD and that this will enable closer monitoring of bee health.”

While limited tests of samples that were taken prior to the start of Australian imports in February 2005 have not found IAPV, researchers want to conduct more comprehensive tests, both on historic samples and on current colonies to determine whether IAPV was already in the U.S. or is a recent phenomenon. ABF President Danny Weaver and Dr. Jeff Pettis of the Beltsville Bee Lab, in Australia for Apimondia, helped to put into place a cooperative agreement under which U.S. and Australian researchers would collect and share samples from colonies in both countries.

“We also do not believe that IAPV can be acting alone to cause CCD, but rather that the virus requires additional triggers,” Dr. Cox-Foster pointed out. “Other pathogens (such as Kashmir Bee Virus, Nosema apis, and Nosema ceranae) may be important in triggering CCD, but by themselves are not the cause of CCD. Also environmental chemicals (pesticides, herbicides, fungicides) and/or nutritional stress may also act as triggers. Of course, the varroa mite may also help to stress colonies and allow for onset of CCD; however, our data clearly demonstrate that varroa, tracheal mites, and nosema do not underlie CCD by themselves.”

As to why the Australians have found no ill effects of IAPV, the researchers point to the absence of Varroa in that country.

Dr. Cox-Foster two of her fellow researchers, Dennis van Englesdorp of Pennsylvania Department of Agriculture and Dr. Pettis, prepared the accompanying “Colony Collapse Disorder and Israeli Acute Paralysis Virus” briefing paper to help beekeepers understand the findings.
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by sammie »

Governor plans to announce wind turbine decision in visit to Garrett County

April 11, 2008 by Lena Vargas in NBC25News

Maryland Governor Martin O'Malley will be in Western Maryland this weekend where he will announce whether the state will allow wind turbines on public land in Garrett County.

Back in January, about 500 people met in a public meeting with the Department of Natural Resources mostly to voice opposition. If approved, about 50 or more turbines would go up at Savage River State Forest.

The state said it needs to expand its wind energy capability to meet future demand and prevent blackouts, but opponents to the plan said the turbines would damage the area's natural beauty and skyline.

The governor's office will not reveal its decision until Saturday morning, but he is expected to say no to wind turbines on public land.

"The picture people have now of the beautiful cascading mountains; 450-million-year-old mountains rising up out of the mist will be completely replaced by massive, skyscraper-sized industrial development, and that is all that people will see," said Jon Boone, Friends of Backbone Mountain.

"What are the drivers for the windmills; it is money. There is definitely green. It's not green energy, it's green backs," said Jeff Conner, Garrett County Homeowner.

If approved, the wind turbines in question would be the first in the state of Maryland to be on public land. The state said it needs to expand its wind energy capability to meet future demand and prevent blackouts. We will have the governor's announcement Saturday on NBC25.

Web link: http://your4state.com/content/fulltext/?sid=3857cf...

Let's all hope for our friends in Maryland that he does say no tomorrow. But what gets me is it is just as damaging to put these facilities on privately owned forested ridges. Something has to be done to stop this on public or private land.
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by My2Cents »

SoccerMom... That was very good information on "bees" that you posted above. I know this is a stupid question, but, I have to ask. Why are we getting imported "packages from Australia and packages of the royal jelly from China," in the first place ?? Are these being sent here only for research, OR, have they always been sending these packages here for USA use ?? I automatically assumed bees were bees, born in the USA. If these "packages" are being imported here, are they taken somewhere and set free to do their thing ?? If so, why ?? What was the matter with using our own, born in the USA, bees ?? Maybe the importing of bees does have something to do with CCD.
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by SoccerMom »

Honey bees are being imported from other countries to be interbreded with our own native species to produce certain traits, such as disease resistance. Pretty ironic, eh? Also, some beekeeper supplement their stock with imported honey bees.

This is getting way off topic, but if you are interesting in helping the honey bees, check out this web site from Haagen-Daz:

http://helpthehoneybees.com/

They just awarded my department at Penn State funding to support honey bee research.
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by Ice Man »

80cobra wrote:I looked at the map Gamesa has for the proposed wind farm 18 look to be on water shed property but the other 12 look to be on private property. Even if the borough decides not to lease the water shed to Gamesa what about the others? How do you stop private land owners from leasing their property? As I understand alot of the property at Blue Knob was private.
Municipalities have the right to control land use under the powers of the PA Municipalities Planning Code. Townships without zoning, such as Snyder, have the right to enact ordinances to protect township residents and the township's natural heritage from harm. If Snyder Township enacts an industrial windplant ordinance prohibiting industrial windplants within County Natural Heritage Areas, as neighboring Tyrone Township and Antis Township have done, then no industrial wind turbines could be built on Ice Mountain, because it is a Blair County Natural Heritage Area (see the Blair County Natural Heritage Inventory at your local municipal office, the Blair County Planning Commission office, or the Blair County Conservation District office).
See the Antis Township Industrial Wind Plant ordinance at http://antistownship.org/antis/lib/anti ... inance.pdf

If Snyder chooses to allow industrial wind turbines, then it can regulate their placement through setbacks to property lines, setbacks to streams, setbacks to residences, noise limits, etc.. Realizing that its industrial wind turbine ordinance was too lenient in light of emerging problems at the Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm, Logan Township is toughening its industrial windplant ordinance, calling for stricter noise limits and more rigorous environmental studies. Logan Township has zoning and zoned Brush Mountain off-limits to industrial windplants because Brush Mountain is a Blair County Natural Heritage Area.
Ice Man
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by Ice Man »

Bill Latchford wrote:I just heard on the news that a theory is out about why the bees are dying off. They are blaming it on air pollution from Cars and Power Plants. It is said that the pollution is masking the fragrance of the flowers and therefore the bees are having a heck of a time finding the plants and therefore cannot make food. I am trying to find a link on CBS's site for this theory.
In the 1960s, 70s, and 90s, the United States Congress enacted a series of Clean Air Acts which significantly strengthened regulation of air pollution. Individual U.S. states, some European nations and eventually the European Union followed these initiatives. The Clean Air Act sets numerical limits on the concentrations of a basic group of air pollutants and provide reporting and enforcement mechanisms.

The effects of these laws have been very positive. In the United States between 1970 and 2006, citizens enjoyed the following reductions in annual pollution emissions:

carbon monoxide emissions fell from 197 million tons to 89 million tons
nitrogen oxide emissions fell from 27 million tons to 19 million tons
sulfur dioxide emissions fell from 31 million tons to 15 million tons
particulate emissions fell by 80%
lead emissions fell by more than 98%


Thus, air pollution is unlikely to be the source of honeybee decline, which probably is due to a pathogen such as a virus, fungus, or bacteria. The honeybee is a native of Europe. Since its decline in the US, it has been replaced by US native bumblebees, which, unfortunately, don't produce the honey that humans crave.
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by My2Cents »

SoccerMom wrote:Honey bees are being imported from other countries to be interbreded with our own native species to produce certain traits, such as disease resistance. Pretty ironic, eh? Also, some beekeeper supplement their stock with imported honey bees.

This is getting way off topic, but if you are interesting in helping the honey bees, check out this web site from Haagen-Daz:

http://helpthehoneybees.com/

They just awarded my department at Penn State funding to support honey bee research.
WOW, that looks like a FANTASTIC site !! Ahhhh, "bees" something new and interesting to read up on and learn about. Thank You soooo much !!!
Meanwhile, sorry for getting off topic folks, back to wind turbines and
SAVE ICE MOUNTAIN !!!
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by sandstone »

Ice Man wrote:
Bill Latchford wrote:I just heard on the news that a theory is out about why the bees are dying off. They are blaming it on air pollution from Cars and Power Plants. It is said that the pollution is masking the fragrance of the flowers and therefore the bees are having a heck of a time finding the plants and therefore cannot make food. I am trying to find a link on CBS's site for this theory.
In the 1960s, 70s, and 90s, the United States Congress enacted a series of Clean Air Acts which significantly strengthened regulation of air pollution. Individual U.S. states, some European nations and eventually the European Union followed these initiatives. The Clean Air Act sets numerical limits on the concentrations of a basic group of air pollutants and provide reporting and enforcement mechanisms.

The effects of these laws have been very positive. In the United States between 1970 and 2006, citizens enjoyed the following reductions in annual pollution emissions:

carbon monoxide emissions fell from 197 million tons to 89 million tons
nitrogen oxide emissions fell from 27 million tons to 19 million tons
sulfur dioxide emissions fell from 31 million tons to 15 million tons
particulate emissions fell by 80%
lead emissions fell by more than 98%


Thus, air pollution is unlikely to be the source of honeybee decline, which probably is due to a pathogen such as a virus, fungus, or bacteria. The honeybee is a native of Europe. Since its decline in the US, it has been replaced by US native bumblebees, which, unfortunately, don't produce the honey that humans crave.
x 2. Air quality has generally improved since the Clean Air Act Ammendments during the Clinton Administration.
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Re: Windmills on Ice Mountain - Gamesa Wind Turbines

Post by sandstone »

Ice Man wrote:
80cobra wrote:I looked at the map Gamesa has for the proposed wind farm 18 look to be on water shed property but the other 12 look to be on private property. Even if the borough decides not to lease the water shed to Gamesa what about the others? How do you stop private land owners from leasing their property? As I understand alot of the property at Blue Knob was private.
Municipalities have the right to control land use under the powers of the PA Municipalities Planning Code. Townships without zoning, such as Snyder, have the right to enact ordinances to protect township residents and the township's natural heritage from harm. If Snyder Township enacts an industrial windplant ordinance prohibiting industrial windplants within County Natural Heritage Areas, as neighboring Tyrone Township and Antis Township have done, then no industrial wind turbines could be built on Ice Mountain, because it is a Blair County Natural Heritage Area (see the Blair County Natural Heritage Inventory at your local municipal office, the Blair County Planning Commission office, or the Blair County Conservation District office).
See the Antis Township Industrial Wind Plant ordinance at http://antistownship.org/antis/lib/anti ... inance.pdf

If Snyder chooses to allow industrial wind turbines, then it can regulate their placement through setbacks to property lines, setbacks to streams, setbacks to residences, noise limits, etc.. Realizing that its industrial wind turbine ordinance was too lenient in light of emerging problems at the Allegheny Ridge Wind Farm, Logan Township is toughening its industrial windplant ordinance, calling for stricter noise limits and more rigorous environmental studies. Logan Township has zoning and zoned Brush Mountain off-limits to industrial windplants because Brush Mountain is a Blair County Natural Heritage Area.
I attended all the meetings of the Snyder Township Planning Commission dealing with industrial windplants (as did Gamesa: Josh Framel, Terry Nicol, Alyssa Edwards). These meetings were held during the summer of 2007. The Snyder Township Planning Commission crafted a draft windplant ordinance which was only slightly more protective of residents and our natural heritage than the ordinances of Greenfield and Juniata Townships, which have caused residents to seek legal action against their own township supervisors! Interestingly, the Snyder Township Planning Commission was dissolved this past winter. I believe that the Snyder Township Supervisors are revisiting the draft ordinance next month.

During the summer of 2007 I asked the Snyder Township Planning Commission to incorporate the following items into the ordinance:

1. Setback of 2500 feet to a residence (including hunting camps)
2. Setback of 1000 feet to a property line
3. Setback of 2000 feet to County Natural Heritage Areas, Important Bird Areas, Important Mammal Areas
4. Mandatory overview by the US Fish and Wildlife Service, with the windplant developer obligated to follow USFWS recommendations.

All these were rejected by the planning commission, even though they are incorporated into the ordinances of Frankstown Township, Antis Township, Tyrone Township, and Logan Township, as well as the Bedford County Planning Commission's Model Industrial Wind Farm Ordinance.
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